Cascade Ruby-Gold color genetics question

[Cotyledon]

In reading about this line of maize I encountered a claim that the red color was a recessive allele in the population.

Is that right?

It looks like the colors are additive and yellow is homozygous and red is homozygous and that shades between are heterozygous. How many color alleles are in this population?

If red is recessive then there are at least 3 alleles for color, but if red is additive then there are probably just two. I ordered some seeds of this line to work with, it's interesting, but I am trying to clear this up now so I don't have to do test crosses this season.

If any color seed in the population can give rise to any other color, that also implies additive genetics rather than recessive and dominant interactions. However I encountered a distinct and specific claim that the red was recessive in this population. That just seems unlikely given the images.

[Cotyledon]

I also read that Roy's Calais is a parent of Painted Mountain.
 
I also read that Painted Mountain was the source of most of the genetics in Carol Deppe's work.

And I also read that Cascade Ruby-Gold is reselected Roy's Calais X Byron making it a selection of Abenaki flint genetics, rather than a selection from Painted Mountain, a flour corn with totally different colors.

I suspect that Abenaki flint genes did play a role in Painted Mountain, but did Painted Mountain play a role in Cascade Ruby-Gold? It doesn't look like it.

[William Schlegel]

I threw cascade ruby gold into my flint grex last year. Haven't had it long enough to know. Didn't read that Carol put any painted mountain in there.

[Cotyledon]

I read more about the subject of pigment genetics in Zea and though many of the interactions are described as recessive and dominant they are still largely additive and this means that two distinct alleles can code for a spectrum-like range of color.

Cascade Ruby-Gold as the name implies, appears to have two allele or allele groups inherited together, coding for the colors Ruby and Yellow and various combinations of the two.

[William Schlegel]

I'm not sure how or if Painted Mountain has changed over the years. When I first got a packet over 20 years ago it grew an 8 row flour corn. I got another packet thinking my saved seed might be old about 12 years ago- it was still fine, but the new packet wasn't different. Though the other corns I've planted with it were.

If you made a mix of 1000 types and planted it all together you would get some crossing for sure.

It isn't as windy in Western MT and I notice corns I plant together staying mostly true to themselves. Some crossing but not too much. I think when it isn't windy a lot of pollen falls straight down.

[Jeremy Weiss]

Some corns have definitely changed/forked over the year I have tried to grow them (changed applies to the same corn from the same source, forked from different sources). I'm fairly sure Navajo Robin's Egg has a MAJOR fork since I can't same to get the same looking corn from any two suppliers (I work on the assumption that the rounded floury white with blue speckles version is the "correct one" as the other one I have seen (say, what you get from Sandhill) doesn't appear to actually HAVE any speckles (it's just a mushy sort of washed out blue) and seems to be more flinty than floury.)

And yes, in low wind conditions, a lot of pollen will just drop straight down. Though that really only helps if the corn  plant has active pollen and silks at the same time (a lot of my plants don't start silking up until a few weeks AFTER their tassels have used up their pollen and withered. I assume this is another self pollination barrier.) 

[grano]

According to Deppe's book, The Resilient Gardener, her Cascade series is based on Abenaki and Byron, both flints.  Her Magic Manna series is based on Painted Mountain, a flour corn.

[grano]

When Deppe's book came out, there were three sisters in the Cascade series: Ruby-Gold, Maple-Gold, and Creamcap.  Maple-Gold was her favorite for polenta, but it no longer seems to be available anywhere.  What happened?

[Tim DH]

According to the TaterMaterSeeds.com board, Tom Wagner had Maple-Gold ten years ago. He was still posting on the board last year, so might be worth an enquiry

Tim DH

[Cotyledon]

Cascade Ruby-Gold did not perform well for me in my conditions.
I will not be growing it again.

[grano]

A possible answer to my question above:  Cascade Ruby-Gold and Maple-Gold were combined.

I bought a packet of Ruby-Gold from Adaptive Seeds last winter; and, after a 36-hour soak, I planted 16 April.  Within 7 days, 73 of 74 seeds came up!  Here's to AS.  However, I have a challenging site for maize here in Calif, and I didn't get much yield.  Maybe next year.