After seeing Joseph point out that runner beans are much easier to landrace than common beans because of higher outcrossing rates, I looked on other forums to see if gardeners were having success with them for pods.
One person said that she found runner beans pods to get tough quickly, so not very suitable for eating fresh pods.
Is this true of all runner beans, or do some coccineus retain soft, edible pods longer in the season?
If there is no known variety of runners beans optimized for keeping pods edible through a long season, it could probably be produced through landracing and selection. Given the difficulty of landracing and selecting vulgaris, this could be an interesting possiblity.
I'd like to obtain or landrace a line of beans that were soft, narrow like French vulgaris, but were outcrossing and more easily adapted.
We always grow lots of runner beans and eat the green pods. They never get a chance to get tough, unless I want to save the seeds. I buy most of my seeds from England and Ireland.
I have read that gardeners in warm parts of North America grow them for the flowers because their gardens are too hot for pods.
I bought some Scarlet Runner seeds from Johnny's. I'll give them a try in 2024 and see what I think. I can always introduce other varieties to create a landrace if these are promising.
Baker Creek sells a couple of interesting ones, one with black pods.
There are also a couple of runner bean/common bean hybrids but I think seeds are available only in Canada (West Coast Seeds) and the U.K. I grew Firestorm this year.
Baker Creek rareseeds.com
Each variety has comments from gardeners who have grown it, and the place they live is included. I looked at some comments about runner beans - from Denver, Pennsylvania, Boston, central California, Fairbanks Alaska, northern New Hampshire etc.
I love runner beans but I'm in a climate where in most years they make very few pods, so I do grow them mostly for the flowers. I've planted lots of kinds over the years but only a couple of them survived and I've never seen evidence of crossing. Lima beans are like that too, supposed to easily cross but in my garden do so less often than common beans. Just last year I found my first possibly off-type Limas which are growing right now.
I was gifted some seeds of a runner/common bean cross one time. They produced absolutely huge vines and abundant flowers, but the pods were few and far between and the seeds were small. I didn't go on with the next generation.
From what I've seen concerning the pods is they are all very good, just have to pick them before they get too big.
I've also had problems with good pod set in the Philadelphia area, which I attribute to our hot and humid summers. I can get a flush of pods late in the season when things cool off a bit but often have issues getting seed to mature before first frost). The pods are very good when picked young before they get fibrous!
I've done a little more research on the subject. Apparently runner beans like cool weather, more similar to the preferences of a fava bean or pea than the typical common beans.
Some gardeners report that a lot of blossom drop occurs in the heat of summer, but that it doesn't hurt the plant, and the flowers set pods again in the cool of fall.
I've planted scarlet runner beans from Johnny's this year, and it will be interesting to see what they produce.
My runner beans generally grow very well bloom abundantly regardless of weather, they just don't set a lot of pods. A branch may have lots of flowers but just one or two pods set. Sometimes little pods abort but for the most part if a pod does form it matures. We usually have them for a few meals but sometimes I feel lucky just to get enough seed for the next year.
When I plant them in a lot of shade by the back deck, they produce a little better. In that spot the ground is very densely shaded but the vines grow up into full sun. Clematis vines are like that too, moist shaded ground to grow in but a trellis or structure to reach full sun.
Rarely, when the weather is cooperative for runner beans, and they produce a lot. That cool, cloudy weather isn't the best for most other things though.
You need more bumblebees, though hummingbirds might also work as pollinators.
Quote from: Diane Whitehead on 2024-05-21, 12:06:36 PMYou need more bumblebees, though hummingbirds might also work as pollinators.
O' I have lots of bumblebees and they love the runner beans, and the hummingbirds do to. One of the reasons I always grow them despite rarely getting any to eat is for the bees and birds. My guess is maybe in hotter temperatures the pollen isn't viable, heck if I know, but it's something other than lack of pollinators.
Seed to Seed by Suzanne Ashworth gives regional growing recommendations.
I don't know what area you are in, so I'll list a few possibilities: Northeast, Mid-Atlantic, Upper Midwest
Any runnerbean can be eaten fresh if the pods are grown very fast. This means you need good, fertile soil and a lot of watering. And preferably a spell of cool weather, rather than the heat of summer. Having said that and compared runnerbeans growing between England and much hotter South German summers, the pink flowered varieties are doing fine for me for pods, the red ones not so much. Celebration has been particularly good for fresh pods, even in very hot weather. I did keep up with watering daily during the hot weather.
We ate a lot of fresh runner beans (scarlet) last year, and they are tasty and tender IF you pick them sufficiently young.
Unfortunately the pods grow and expand very quickly, so it you are inattentive or away from home for just a few days, the pods growing at that time quickly become tough and fibrous, and need to be discarded.
It would be interesting to breed a runner bean for tender, stringless pods.
You could try these two hybrids of runner x common beans:
Firestorm and Tenderstar
Apparently it took 15 years to produce a hybrid, so you'll need to be patient if you want to do a cross yourself.
I haven't tried saving seeds from them yet to see what the next generation will be. I'll do that this year.
I've been reading an earlier thread from 2018: Hybrid Beans started by Joseph Lofthouse.
Moonlight: The world's first self-pollinating white flowered runner bean - sets well even in poor conditions The original French/Runner bean cross variety introduced in 2011
Quote from: Cathy A on 2023-06-26, 12:53:07 PMOne person said that she found runner beans pods to get tough quickly, so not very suitable for eating fresh pods.
Is this true of all runner beans, or do some coccineus retain soft, edible pods longer in the season?
I think exactly "How tender" you pick them makes the biggest differnece. If picked tender enough, any species of
Phaseolus will make good green beans.
There are also many dual-purpose Runnerbeans cultivars with good edible pods & mature seeds.
Also no variety is truly stringless, just some are less stringy than others.
With runnerbeans that are picked more mature, you can peel the string side with a vegetable peeler.
Some Runner Bean varieties have been bred for edible pods and some for seeds.
British plant breeders have done a lot of work developing runner beans for the pods.
Adaptive Seeds has bred and sells an OSSI-Pledged variety 'British Pop', which is an interbreeding gene pool population started with all British varieties bred for the pods.