Revitalizing Heirloom Tomatoes into new more vigorous varieties

[reed]

William, wasn't there some pimpinellifolium in both of the crosses you did with Mr. Stripey and Hoosier Rose? If so, the Mr. S cross recovered to a larger size nicely just from the F1. It isn't as big as what I'm used to with pure Mr. Stripey but I'm very happy with it. The HR cross came out smaller but with very good flavor. I ended up already with the best of both, just not together in the same one yet but I think I'm ok with that too, not to mention I expect lots of new and maybe better ones from the F2 seed. 

[Tim DH]

There is of course the possibility that raising F1s (and sticking with that) is the way forward for these Heirlooms.

Has anyone successfully re-created Craig's GiftF1? First referenced at #13 on the F1s for the People! thread. It was originally recommended for flavour, but I'm curious to know how it performs in the vigour department.

Tim DH

[reed]

There is of course the possibility that raising F1s (and sticking with that) is the way forward for these Heirlooms
Tim DH

That's what I'm going to do. I'm terrible at purposeful cross pollination, record keeping and everything else that makes a good plant breeder, but I can do selection. The mother side of the crosses I keep talking about that William are from my own that have grown in my own soil for a long time. The father side is a bit complicated, only William knows for sure. I only grew about five plants of the F1s and all five of them were distinct phenotypes.

Two of them were as early and productive as anything in my garden or more so, they tolerated disease and drought as well or better had fine flavor. I figure as diverse as the F1 was, if I grow a whole bunch of the F2s I may soon discover replacements for my old wonderfully flavored, but poorly producing beefsteak heirlooms. O' and on top of that the plants did not grow quite as huge and sprawling, it would be nice not having to build or move big trellises every year.

I just reread your quote, if you mean continuing to make F1s, I can't do that. I just want to grow them out when someone else does it and see what comes from them in future seasons. 

[William Schlegel]

William, wasn't there some pimpinellifolium in both of the crosses you did with Mr. Stripey and Hoosier Rose? If so, the Mr. S cross recovered to a larger size nicely just from the F1. It isn't as big as what I'm used to with pure Mr. Stripey but I'm very happy with it. The HR cross came out smaller but with very good flavor. I ended up already with the best of both, just not together in the same one yet but I think I'm ok with that too, not to mention I expect lots of new and maybe better ones from the F2 seed. 

The Hoosier Rose cross is Hoosier Rose x (MMM x LA1375) where LA1375 is a currant tomato from South America and MMM is a bicolor. It is an example of a back cross to domestic that should have even better size recovery in some of the F2.

The Mr Stripey cross is with MMM x Purple Zebra F1 so is a domestic cross. It should also have better size recovery in a portion of the F2.

[William Schlegel]

The other two crosses in my collaboration with Reed are Utah Heart x (MMM x Sweet Cherriette) and
Utah Heart x (MMR Dwarf). Where MMR Dwarf is MMM x Aztek micro dwarf a yellow microdwarf that had the best flavor of several micro dwarfs I tried and seemed early.

Reed's three tomatoes Hoosier Rose, Utah Heart, and Mr. Stripey also performed exceptionally well for a collaborator in a disease prone zone of Coastal California. So, from their survival and productivity we could think of them as good sources of vigor and the collaboration an attempt at this concept of reinvigorating heirlooms. Reed had some concern he had too few. Of the four though the cross I'm most excited about is Hoosier Rose x (MMM x LA1375) because of the LA1375 currant tomato from South America content.

[reed]

I didn't grow the Utah Heart crosses because of lack of space. I wasn't really planning to grow then next year either for the same reason, but the Mr. S and HR came out so good, I think I'll try to find a spot for some.

The Hoosier Rose x (MMM x LA1375) was productive, early and conditions tolerant but what surprised me most was the excellent flavor. It will be really cool if larger ones show up from the F2 seeds.