Author Topic: Frost and Cold Tolerant Tomato Breeding including epigenetic and regular genetic  (Read 8378 times)

Garrett Schantz

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Flower color in Joseph's picture is consistent with  Beta orange genetics, that is also found in wild relatives.
tangerine t is the other common orange gene, found in domestic tomatoes.

There is an explanation for why the orange would appear from plant parents that weren't orange.  Beta is only expressed in a red background.  So if one of the parents was yellow or bicolor afaik, Beta could be present but would not be expressed.  In an F1 cross with a r/r red the F1 will ripen orange-red.  So you can see Beta is present even in B/- but only if the base color  is red.    Some recent work suggested Beta is an allele of the same locus as oldgold and ogc oldgoldcrimson.  The Beta allele results in a high content of Beta carotene instead of lycopene.

Tangerine orange is a different locus and works very differently.  It is recessive, so t/- F1 will not show any orange.  However it can be expressed in any background, red, or yellow or bicolor afaik.  The flowers of a t/t tangerine plant will have an orange anther cone and the petals as they dry turn peach orange instead of straw yellow.  The intensity of color does vary depending on the background and possibly some modifiers, but it is recognizable if you're looking for it.  Tangerine orange fruit is rich in prolycopene, and low in beta carotene.  So they are nutritionally different as well.

There are other orange genetics (Delta, apricot) but they are rare by comparison.  Apricot has almost white flowers.  Delta fruit is more like a shade of red than orange.  I haven't encountered either of these in orange fruit I've grown.

Don't suppose the flower here could be Apricot? Found it on one of my mix of F1 pimpinellifolium crosses. I think there were a few others like that. They are all dead now though.

Also posting a strange flowering - whatever it was. The plants with these small buds eventually formed real flowers.

I am going to recreate my initial cross with pimpinellifolium - habrochaites. I am assuming that I had some variation in the F1 because I used over 30 fruits - and their seeds, screened for anything off-type from the parent. Being different species, I could have lost initial genetic information in that original cross due to only saving seed from a few F1 crosses... Next time I will grow most of the hybrids outdoors where I have room for them.

Also, if I can reproduce the white flowered types, that would be pretty nice.

(Suppose I got everyone a bit off topic!)
« Last Edit: 2021-07-07, 12:32:24 AM by Garrett Schantz »

Steph S

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Wow Garrett, those are truly gorgeous.  8)  Very cool.  There are pics of apricot flower type at TGRC if you want to compare.
That habrochaites anther color is also really pretty.  :)

Guessing genetics by flower color is a little tricky, because the color changes as pollen matures and is shed.  So you need to look at flowers in different stages.  When I get a chance I'll start a thread and try to get some decent pics to show the recognizable types that I know.
The tangerine orange anther cone is a deep orange color as soon as it opens. Petals start yellow but then fade peachy pale orange as they begin to age.   
Flowers on beta, red, bicolor or pink fruited start either a warm yellow or light orange that quickly deepens to orange as pollen matures and is shed.
Flowers on yellow or gf (black or brown) fruited start a greenish yellow but may also turn a warmer yellow to orange from the pollen being shed by the time they're done, however that is slower than the development of orange color in the red or Beta type.

If the orange in your habrochaites crosses is tangerine, that could also turn up unexpectedly from non-orange parents because of t being recessive and not expressed at all as t/-.

The conclusive way to determine if Sungold is Beta or tangerine, would be to cross it to a red and a yellow fruit and check the progeny: In a red cross, F1 Beta will ripen orange-red, and 3/4 F2 will be expected to be orange or orange-red.   F1 tangerine will be just red, and the 1/4 ratio expected for orange fruit in F2.  In a yellow (or bicolor? afaik) cross with Beta, you should get no orange in F1 or F2, while tangerine will show up as yellow-orange or light orange in F2 at the 1/4 ratio.

Roland

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Very interesting hypothesis that the orange of Sungold Beta is carotene.
The orange in the flowers in tangerine is indeed missing.
I have already made the cross between Sungold and Sungreen. Sungreen is a green tomato and contains yellow(rr) homozygous.

I can make another cross with Sungold x Dorada (Yellow), Sungold x Clou (Yellow) or sungold x Sunviva (Yellow) and of course another cross with a red tomato.

The F1 with a cross of a yellow tomato will possess:
Sungold RR,BB x Yellow rr,--
Rr,B- and yet also show Red and Beta. As a result, I think the phenotype of SunGold x yellow tomato should also be orange?


Steph S

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Indeed, Roland, I don't know if Rr is enough for the B/- to show up.  Look forward to hearing your results.

Garrett Schantz

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Wow Garrett, those are truly gorgeous.  8)  Very cool.  There are pics of apricot flower type at TGRC if you want to compare.
That habrochaites anther color is also really pretty.  :)

Guessing genetics by flower color is a little tricky, because the color changes as pollen matures and is shed.  So you need to look at flowers in different stages.  When I get a chance I'll start a thread and try to get some decent pics to show the recognizable types that I know.
The tangerine orange anther cone is a deep orange color as soon as it opens. Petals start yellow but then fade peachy pale orange as they begin to age.   
Flowers on beta, red, bicolor or pink fruited start either a warm yellow or light orange that quickly deepens to orange as pollen matures and is shed.
Flowers on yellow or gf (black or brown) fruited start a greenish yellow but may also turn a warmer yellow to orange from the pollen being shed by the time they're done, however that is slower than the development of orange color in the red or Beta type.

If the orange in your habrochaites crosses is tangerine, that could also turn up unexpectedly from non-orange parents because of t being recessive and not expressed at all as t/-.



The images that I posted were of my F1 habrochaites x pimpinellifolium. Sadly no longer have them - had too many pots, thinned a bunch of plants out and used them to obtain F2 seed for this growing season.

The F1 types were columnar in terms of growth.

The white flowered type only had that color on a single plant, I used two wild species - wasn't that fun to manage / tie up a stick.

Hopefully I will find the white color again. Along with any other fun genetics.

The F2 plants will probably have a wide mix of different fruit colors. Should be fun.

Roland

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SunGold F1 is giving a lot of pollen. About 10 times more as my domestic tomatoes.

Today I made the crosses:
Sunviva (Yellow) x Sungold F1
Dorada (Yellow) x Sungold F1
Clou (Yellow) x Sungold F1
Primavera (Red) x Sungold F1
Read Pearl (Red) x Sungold F1
Sungold F1 x Sunviva (Yellow)
Sungold F1 x West Virginia 17B (Red beef)

The flowers used had 1 or 2 petals open and I removed the pollen from this.
Is it true that these are still too young for self-pollination?

Steph S

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I didn't see a thread about crossing techniques so I just started one, Roland.  I often use flowers that are just starting to open, as long as the petals still look white I believe the flower is still immature.

Garrett Schantz

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Doing some cold tolerant - earliness testing next year.

Burnley's Bounty - Probably cold tolerance from S. Peruvianum, currently have one plant growing, may be able to confirm this year.

Purple Smudge - Multiple accounts of cold tolerance. Might be able to find out this year as well.

Stupicke Polni Rane - Early, ties in well with cold tolerance.

Saraev M-22 - Multiple forums have pointed out that the cold tolerance in this variety is probably epigenetic, I received my seed from J&L Gardens in New Mexico, may or may not have the epigenetics currently active.

Sub Arctic Plenty - I have a single seed left, will try planting it next year.


Ordered Polar Beauty and Polar Star for next year, they probably have cold tolerance (descriptions of both mention being able set fruit in the 40s, there are some other varieties like this).

Both of these varieties were bred for Alaska's climate.

Unsure if these are a part of the same series as "Polar Circle" which was crossed with Farthest North to create Earlinorth - an early cool tolerant tomato that sets at low temperatures.

Darrel Jones mentions Earlinorth quite a bit in his cold tolerance posts / breeding topics.


I have been finding mixed results online on whether or not Sub Arctic Plenty has the ft gene(fruiting temperature gene) or if its just very stress tolerant. Some websites mention that it can set fruit at lower temps.

Also of course going to be looking for some cold tolerant genes from habrochaites wildlings - etc.

I am unsure if S. Peruvianum shares its cold tolerant genes with cold tolerant S. habrochaites cultivars or not. Should be fun to play around with either way.



Probably going to cross the best performing plant with the ft gene with something like Exserted Orange. At the same time I would be crossing things with noted stress or cold tolerance into Exserted Orange as well. Eventually they would be combined into one base. The nice thing about this is that most of these varieties are early enough that I could do multiple generations within a single year.


Going to be screening plants for anything that puts on new growth in cold temperatures as well. By the end of the year things become "blighty". No new growth pretty wipes out the full potential of the other traits if the plant dies.

Exsertion may or may not be selected for. I do want to add/stabilize all of these traits into a Promiscuous population at some point.

Darrel Jones is already working on something similar, figured I could try out my own version.

Garrett Schantz

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Species other than S. peruvianum and S. habrochaites have cold tolerant traits.

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10681-008-9863-6
https://asset-pdf.scinapse.io/prod/2116776415/2116776415.pdf

S. lycopersicoides and S. chilense also contain some cold tolerant traits, seem a bit more uncommon in these sort of topics - though mentioned at times.


S. lycopersicoides branched off from the "Lycopersicon clade" along with S. sitiens quite some time ago. Hopefully, this means that there are some novel cold tolerant genes that could be mixed with already existing traits.

S. lycopersicoides LA2408, LA2781 grow in some pretty cold climates. The species has been recorded growing 3,700 m - which is higher than other tomato relatives (Quoting this from the PDF, this could have changed or be incorrect). These accessions could be exposed to slightly freezing air or chilling from a nearby volcano - the plants are also apparently pretty exposed, which means there isn't insulation from nearby surfaces.

Possibly better than the 25 - 30F minimum survival trait from S. habrochaites, or just as good. The traits might work well together, probably aren't the same due to being from different clades.

S. chilense accessions have been recorded around S. lycopersicoides LA2408, LA2781 but don't grow nearly as high up. (Listed as the Putre Area in the PDF)


I found mention of LA2408, LA2781 from Andrew on another forum - back in 2017. Having cold tolerant genes that perform better than S. habrochaites genes could be nice.


Of course, most S. lycopersicoides accessions don't cross easily with species in the Lycopersicon clade. Doubting that the trait would result in frost hardiness either, could still be very nice.  (The Abg gene is also found in S. lycopersicoides)
« Last Edit: 2021-09-11, 01:36:39 AM by Garrett Schantz »

William S.

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Speaking of exserted orange. My 2021 grow out for snake river froze to the ground and resprouted except for one plant that survived unscathed. Then a few plants lost some leaves in August to early light frosts. Just picked a bunch for seed last night. Should get me to the ounce I need. Would be done by now with that if not for the set back.
Western Montana garden, glacial lake Missoula sediment lacustrian parent material and shallow 7" silty clay loam mollisoil topsoil sometimes with added sand in places. Zone 6A with 100 to 130 frost free days