Author Topic: Peas 2021  (Read 2492 times)

Andrew Barney

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Re: Peas 2021
« Reply #15 on: 2021-05-21, 07:03:41 AM »
Well I guess you are right on time then.

Interesting study. I've often wondered if Biskopens aka. Swedish Red is so heat tolerant purely just because it hasn't flowered yet when the heat hits. I think its just a long season pea and the plant has to survive to make seeds.

I want to watch for peas that regrow from the roots in late summer after they have appeared to have died. I think I started pulling out m peas a few years ago when I noticed some from "Large Podded" starting to regrow unexpectedly. I could have gotten a second crop with already established roots. Probably would have grown back twice as fast.

Anyone else growing / breeding peas?

I know lots of people on the forum are growing peas based on Bill's report last year. http://opensourceplantbreeding.org/forum/index.php?topic=2.msg2658#msg2658
« Last Edit: 2021-05-21, 07:10:42 AM by Andrew Barney »

Jeremy Weiss

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Re: Peas 2021
« Reply #16 on: 2021-05-21, 07:15:19 AM »
Has anyone tried checking peas from the more Southern reaches of their growing range for heat tolerance?  I have no idea how far south peas are commonly grown (and the matter is complicated by the fact that, at a certain point, peas switch from being a crop you grow in the early spring to one you grow over the winter, so south doesn't necessarily equal heat tolerant.) But it might be of use.

The most southern area I KNOW grows peas is the bottom of Italy, since there is the "wild" peas of Rovigno (which being in the very north of Italy (actually now in Croatia) and Piselle d' Ago (which I think is from fairly far south.)

Petra Suckling

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Re: Peas 2021
« Reply #17 on: 2021-05-21, 02:34:56 PM »
Andrew, no not as spectacular as your fully red flower.  These are cr flowers. 
Central England, cool, maritime (ish), cloudy, often dry, but recent weather unpredictable

B. Copping

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Re: Peas 2021
« Reply #18 on: 2021-05-31, 11:19:35 PM »
It's probably at least an F2 as I think the red pea testa trait is recessive. I sent some of my mixed up dwarf grey sugar peas to Canada to Brenda and Dianne and I think Brenda sent some seeds back and one was one that had red seeds marked as "dwarf grey sugar x biskopens cross ?". I know some of the seed i sent was mixed up and/or hybridized as i was sloppy with my seed that year I was trying to cross Biskopens to any and every other kind of pea. I know i did not send Brenda any red seeds, so whatever came back sounded very interesting and is the first biskopens hybrid that has wrinkled seeds.

I have some other Biskopens hybrids that i've been trying to keep growing for a few seasons. Biskopens is a very late pea for me as well and very tall too. I mostly wanted to cross it with a shorter season pea but retain the dark red seeds. ...

Iím inclined to think the seeds I sent back are F2+.
All the DGS seed that I planted (from Andrew) were round, green with purple spots.
Plant height was intermediate between Biskopens and the DGS line Iíve been maintaining.
Picture of seed and pod types that segregated:
« Last Edit: 2021-05-31, 11:49:25 PM by B. Copping »

Andrew Barney

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Re: Peas 2021
« Reply #19 on: 2021-06-01, 12:44:01 AM »
Thanks Brenda for the photo!

Finally got homemade trellis put in for the second batch of 10 lines today. Cut chicken wire fencing with bamboo poles (although these ones were plastic tomato stakes).

Expected more peas to be flowering, but so far only the Alaska hybrids are flowering. Others will be soon in first batch of 10.

Steph S

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Re: Peas 2021
« Reply #20 on: 2021-06-01, 04:30:55 AM »
Very helpful for me to see how they segregated, and to hear that the plant height was intermediate.

I grew Biskopens and Amplissimo from the same seed source together in the row, and I was surprised to find some constricted pods with Amplissimo type seeds in them.  IDK which seed they came from, but it's possibly a segregating cross of the two.  I'm going to grow them and see if they are segregating or not.  Amplissimo is just a bit shorter than Biskopens but quite a bit earlier.   
In any case I'm going to aim for a much shorter pea if I can make a good cross.

William S.

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Re: Peas 2021
« Reply #21 on: 2021-06-01, 06:28:23 PM »
Volunteer probably Austrian winter peas are back some of them growing for a second year just out in the grasses.
Western Montana garden, glacial lake Missoula sediment lacustrian parent material and shallow 7" silty clay loam mollisoil topsoil sometimes with added sand in places. Zone 6A with 100 to 130 frost free days

Steph S

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Re: Peas 2021
« Reply #22 on: 2021-06-17, 07:03:08 PM »
So here are some of the peas I've planted so far, on the project of dry peas for winter.
The three bush types which I got from Salt Spring are pretty similar looking, they're all maple types. 
I have a row of tall peas on trial that are or look like they might make interesting winter food.   A few Corne de Belier went in this row as well, with Brazilian (looks maple, a large snow pea), King Tut, Calvert, Magnolia Cross (from friend Nicky's garden), Irish Prean, and Clarke's Beltony Blue, shown in the pic. 
Another pic to compare the size and color of Magnolia Cross, my purple Shiraz seed, and Biskopens.  All 3 are quite different colors.
Last not least my crop peas Biskopens and Bulroyd Bean as they were soaking, just to show the enormous size of Bulroyd Bean.   They were really productive last year, although really late. 
Trellis building is still in progress but the crop peas are closing in on a foot tall still under row cover, so I need to finish that soon. 

Andrew Barney

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Re: Peas 2021
« Reply #23 on: 2021-06-23, 06:25:59 AM »
I'll see if i can post some photos despite them not being high quality.

But here is a preliminary pea report for pea patch 1. pea patch 2 has suffered some drought and some stunted growth so I'm not sure i can evaluate any from patch 2 for eating qualities.

Taste Test Winner 2021: "Large Podded" which consists mostly of 'Green Beauty' (also has 'Carouby de Maussane' & 'Bijou'). Winner another year in a row. Large succulent pods that are still tasty when the seeds start to get large. If you have limited space this is the one to grow.

Next Best" 'Opal Beauty' from Peace Seedlings: Pretty Good. Very tasty large yellow peas with edible pods. I will grow this one again. Best yellow podded pea available anywhere.

'Ruby Beauty': OK flavor. not amazing not terrible. Red pods are decently colored though red pods are still mostly just to grow something different. Sadly I suspect red podded peas will not get better than this. If you want a red podded pea get this one,

My red podded breeding line 'Colorado Red Improved' ('Colorado Red' x Midnight Snow): Ok flavor. Not amazing, but improved greatly. Edible. Color is not stabilized yet due to non-homozygous purple genes in Midnight Snow.

'Honeysnap II': Dwarf plants. Not bad. Will grow this one again. Best yellow snap pea I've tasted or grown. Pods produce in clumps of 2-3 each. very productive. Taste like a snap pea. Has darker yellow pods than other yellow podded peas. Interesting. Worth breeding with.

'Purple Beauty': Not bad flavor. Good purple color. Not bad flavor for a purple podded pea. Worth growing. Not as good as green beauty, but a nice companion to green beauty.

'Amethyst Beauty': Meh. flavor not that good. Color not that good. not worth growing. Purple Beauty is better.

Royal Snap II: Meh. True snap pods as compared to Sugar Magnolia's half-snap pods. Flavor is not that great, but maybe edible. Might be good for breeding. Dwarf. Good dark purple pods.

Royal Snow: Meh. Good dark purple pods. Flavor about the same as Royal Snap II. Worth growing? Maybe, maybe not. dwarf.

F2 hybrid 'Alaska' x P. elatius: Edible shelling pea. Not amazing, but had some pods with red spots that turn to black spots when drying down. Medium height.
« Last Edit: 2021-06-23, 06:30:10 AM by Andrew Barney »

Andrew Barney

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Re: Peas 2021
« Reply #24 on: 2021-07-06, 01:14:58 PM »
Meant to post this a few weeks ago.

Here was my follow up evaluation after a few weeks of the first review.

Taste Tests for purple / red pods:

Midnight snow - great!
Amethyst beauty - very poor
Purple snap / snow ok / edible. Dwarf. Good color.
Ruby beauty - meh. Bleh.
Purple beauty- meh. But good color.
Bauregarde - ok. Sweet but grisly. Very dwarf.

So in this taste test Midnight Snow still seems like my favorite. Can't remember how it compares to Sugar Magnolia.

And Bauregarde might taste better than I originally thought,  but not exactly my favorite by any stretch. Maybe deserves another grow trial.

And Royal Snap II (and Royal Snow) is just ok, but might be worth growing if you want good dark purple pods and a true snap shape and crunch (as opposed to sugar Magnolia which is a half-snap as Carol Deppe called it).

Ruby Beauty is a red pod but really mediocre. Mostly just a fun plant, not good for eating. Maybe there is hope for my red podded breeding line yet.

Kapuler bred Purple Beauty is dark and large pods. Mediocre flavor.
« Last Edit: 2021-07-06, 01:23:43 PM by Andrew Barney »

Steph S

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Re: Peas 2021
« Reply #25 on: 2021-07-17, 01:37:18 PM »
Margaret McKee's baking pea is first to flower for me - 40 days from planting.  A lovely red, and they are blooming in pairs which is a nice trait.

Steph S

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Re: Peas 2021
« Reply #26 on: 2021-07-17, 01:41:38 PM »
In other pea news, one of my tall pea trellises has been visited by a moose, already.  The plants are about 3 1/2 ft tall, and the moose has nipped the shoots at about 2ft on one side of the trellis.  I am wondering, can anyone tell me if there is a chance peas will make new leaders after such a pruning?
We usually have moose here in October but there is this 'nibbler' that has been coming around in July and sampling this and that.  Which is unfortunate for peas that haven't made any um peas yet.  ::)

Andrew Barney

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Re: Peas 2021
« Reply #27 on: 2021-07-17, 05:06:49 PM »
In other pea news, one of my tall pea trellises has been visited by a moose, already.  The plants are about 3 1/2 ft tall, and the moose has nipped the shoots at about 2ft on one side of the trellis.  I am wondering, can anyone tell me if there is a chance peas will make new leaders after such a pruning?
We usually have moose here in October but there is this 'nibbler' that has been coming around in July and sampling this and that.  Which is unfortunate for peas that haven't made any um peas yet.  ::)

They should. I think they can grow out at any node.

Similarly I am starting to think most peas can regrow in late summer from the roots after they appear to die if not ripped out. Im doing an experiment to see if cutting them near the ground will allow this regrowth here and whether it is all or only some varieties prone to doing this. Will let you know if I learn anything and whether they have enough time to produce a second crop if they do grow back.

Steph S

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Re: Peas 2021
« Reply #28 on: 2021-07-17, 05:32:27 PM »
That's great Andrew, I can have hope then...  although these peas (Biskopens and Bulroyd Bean) are late enough as it is, so even if they do regrow, they may be too late.   
Please do let us know how your experiment comes out.   I've noticed what seemed to be regrowth from the ground level with a couple of peas in the past - Norli is one, Golden Sweet the other.   

Andrew Barney

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Re: Peas 2021
« Reply #29 on: 2021-07-17, 11:49:23 PM »
Sorted some biskopens hybrids today. A decent amount were early, had reddish, wrinkled, and purverize-to-dust pods. Think these may be the ones with dwarf grey sugar ancestry. Some others had purple pods. Some others were not done growing but I picked them anyway and pods are still green. These seem to be late season like biskopens original. I will need to keep growing out the best from this lot as they seem to have good potential. Maybe I should just filter by earlyness.

Was sorting through my crop of "nap gene" peas. Luckily someone sent me back a small packet I had shared with them that they never grew. When i harvested seeds and sorted them today i noticed a majority had shelling type pods and small round seeds (though they did have water issues this year). A minority came out with pulverize-to-dust snap pods, and wrinkled seeds as expected. Considering the shelling type pods I would speculate that these were unexpected F1 hybrids from last time I grew "nap gene". This is interesting and exciting because this suggests I was right that this variety in having the mutation to have an open keel allows this variety to be pretty much an obligate outcrossing variety in the right conditions with the right pollinators. I again noticed lots of leaf cutter bees this year feasting on the pea leaves.

From simple math by weight of seeds, "nap gene" seems to be between 79%-86% outcrossing! This is not entirely correct as the normal seeds are larger and this year the others had tiny seeds maybe due to overcrowding and semi-drought. But even with this error it seems this variety of pea could be an 80% outcrosser! Could be very useful for someone wanting to breed for pest or disease resistance without needing to hand cross as much.

EDIT: of course it could be possible I hand crossed these last time I grew them and forgot. Hmm. Now im not sure. Regardless I like this variety. It tastes good as a snap pea as it is with no breeding needed.
« Last Edit: 2021-07-18, 12:11:41 PM by Andrew Barney »