Author Topic: TPS 2020  (Read 859 times)

nathanp

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TPS 2020
« on: 2020-04-07, 08:57:22 PM »
I have not noticed a post on TPS (True Potato Seed) so far this year, but thought I would start one and ask what forum members are growing out this year, and 'why', if they have particular reasons for doing so.

What I am growing out this year are four different 'groups' that I will be keeping separate, but mainly just for purposes of organization. 

Group 1 are diploid lines.  Most of these are being grown to try to identify diploid fingerlings to use in future breeding work. Diploids normally do not grow well for me and have lower yields than what I normally find 'acceptable'.  I have some seed from a Skagit Valley Gold F1 tuber that is dark yellow that I will be looking for deep yellow or orange flesh in seedlings from.

Group 2 are tetraploid lines for the same purpose, mostly looking for fingerlings

Group 3 is tetraploid S. acroscopicum.  Bill W grew this USDA GRIN accession out last year and sent me several promising tubers from it to evaluate for possible CPB resistance or tolerance.  I will be growing out more seedlings from the same accession this year for the same reason to try to develop a breeding block of several clones if this appears promising.

Group 4 are tetraploid lines to identify CPB resistant potatoes.  Most of these either have Type A and Type B trichome hairs for CPB resistance, so offspring will segregate for those, or they are TPS from lines with S. berthaultii in their pedigree, or are TPS from a parent that has had noticeably less predation by CPB in my growing area (anecdotal).

I usually field select the most vigorous or interesting looking plants from those I grow from seed, so the numbers planted will be far lower than what is germinated.  I estimate I will be planting a total of only about 150-175 of these this year, but who knows where else I might find room for these?  Or just pack them together very tightly?

These are the lists of which TPS batches are in each group.  .
« Last Edit: 2020-04-07, 09:02:23 PM by nathanp »

William S.

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Re: TPS 2020
« Reply #1 on: 2020-04-07, 09:27:06 PM »
I hope to find and dig out a packet Joseph sent me. Also hoping to get some certified seed potatoes and I think I heard Yukon gold is a good berry producer.
Western Montana garden, glacial lake Missoula sediment lacustrian silty clay mollisoil sometimes with added sand in places. Zone 6A with 100 to 130 frost free days

nathanp

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Re: TPS 2020
« Reply #2 on: 2020-04-07, 10:34:25 PM »
I hope to find and dig out a packet Joseph sent me. Also hoping to get some certified seed potatoes and I think I heard Yukon gold is a good berry producer.

Yes, Yukon Gold is known for being a reliable berry producer. 

Ferdzy

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Re: TPS 2020
« Reply #3 on: 2020-04-08, 05:16:38 AM »
I am no longer eating much in the way of potatoes since I am now pre-diabetic but I am still interested in them! We are growing out a few things - German Butterball, Red Thumb, unknown Latvian potato, and - I hope- seeds from a mauve-fleshed seedling which we will be planting out for the 3rd time this year. Could just be the ubiquitous Russian Blue that pops up all over the garden but I think not. We'll see.

Why these? Because they are the most interesting looking of the few seeds we have on hand at the moment. The Latvian potato in particular tends to throw seedlings that grow to full size and good productivity in their first year, but so far of undistinguished flavour.

We do have a couple of potatoes we are growing on. As well as the mauve one, I particularly like a blocky, oblong one that produces nice-sized potatoes with moderately good productivity. The flesh is dry, but a pretty pale peach when raw and stays a warm cream when cooked. Nice flavour. I believe it is the offspring of Pink Fir Apple.

nathanp

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Re: TPS 2020
« Reply #4 on: 2020-04-12, 06:34:53 AM »
I am no longer eating much in the way of potatoes since I am now pre-diabetic but I am still interested in them! We are growing out a few things - German Butterball, Red Thumb, unknown Latvian potato, and - I hope- seeds from a mauve-fleshed seedling which we will be planting out for the 3rd time this year. Could just be the ubiquitous Russian Blue that pops up all over the garden but I think not. We'll see.

Why these? Because they are the most interesting looking of the few seeds we have on hand at the moment. The Latvian potato in particular tends to throw seedlings that grow to full size and good productivity in their first year, but so far of undistinguished flavour.

We do have a couple of potatoes we are growing on. As well as the mauve one, I particularly like a blocky, oblong one that produces nice-sized potatoes with moderately good productivity. The flesh is dry, but a pretty pale peach when raw and stays a warm cream when cooked. Nice flavour. I believe it is the offspring of Pink Fir Apple.

Ferdzy, there is a good deal of development currently going on now to breed potatoes that have a better glycemic index, and have high amylose, rather than sucrose/glucose. You'll probably start to see those entering the market as specialty potatoes marketed towards people who are diabetic or pre-diabetic.  As a generaliztion, waxy potatoes have a better glycemic index than starchy potatoes.  Often these are marketed as small or 'new' potatoes, but many fingerlings fit in this category (though not Purple Peruvian, which is starchy).  The large russets have the highest starch content in general, so those are the ones to steer clear of the most.  Another way to describe it would be that good 'boiling' potatoes would be good ones to consider eating.

Interestingly, the 2019 USDA Ars-Grin ad hoc tuber list offerings had a large number of potatoes with high amylose content, and there are a few people I am aware of that specifically ordered these with the intent to work with them and TPS from them to grow potatoes that are more amicable for pre-diabetic or diabetic family members. 
« Last Edit: 2020-04-12, 06:36:52 AM by nathanp »

Ferdzy

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Re: TPS 2020
« Reply #5 on: 2020-04-12, 06:58:35 AM »
A few years back I went to an information day with a potato breeder, and the question of lower-glycemic potatoes came up. His take was that although different varieties of potatoes did vary slightly, the big difference was in how they were prepared. Hot ashed potatoes, freshly cooked, are the worst for raising blood-sugar, and cold, chunky potatoes - think salad - are the best.

Since then, a lot of information has become available about resistant starches. It turns out the best way to eat potatoes is to cook them, cool them, then cook them again. I did an experiment where I ate chicken, boiled potatoes and vegetables for dinner, measured my blood sugar (fairly bad) and then did the same thing the next night - chicken, same vegetables, and fried leftover potatoes - measured my blood-sugar again (quite good). I did the same thing with a pasta dinner, but reheated pasta is not nearly as nice as fried leftover potatoes, and the differences were nowhere near as pronounced.

I think this is a case where cooking habits can overtake breeding by quite a bit. But yes, it would be interesting to see some lower-glycemic potatoes. Do you know the names of any high-amylose potatoes?

nathanp

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Re: TPS 2020
« Reply #6 on: 2020-04-12, 05:24:28 PM »
Here is a list exported from the USDA Ars-Grin genebank.

The ones I see that should be available in the US through seed tubers suppliers are Desiree, Papa Cacho, and Ozette.  I would imagine there are others in the same range as these, but are not in available through the genebank.  If I were to consider breeding with some of these to develop lines for this use, UNALM GUISI, LOSHITSKY, PAPA CACHO, TOLLOCAN, GUI VALLEY and DESIREE would be good ones to start with that should easily product TPS.  Those are all long day adapted.  MURU is very long season (150+ days) and WAC 1445 is a short day adapted potato, so if you cannot grow potatoes into November, those aren't great options to start with.  There are quite a few European bred varieties in this list, so those in the EU should have access to many of these.

The top of the list, ranked by highest Amylose content:
accession_number observation_value plant_name taxon
280952 42.1 WAC 1445 Solanum tuberosum subsp. andigenum
657136 39.5 MURU Solanum tuberosum
657137 39.1 UNALM GUISI Solanum tuberosum
283141 38.7 OCH 1402 Solanum tuberosum subsp. andigenum
634532 38.5 CANCHAN - INIA Solanum tuberosum
473260 37.5 HOF 2065 Solanum tuberosum subsp. andigenum
475781 37.4 LOSHITSKY Solanum tuberosum
657133 37.1 MARIA HUANCA Solanum tuberosum
310490 37 CCC 1350 Solanum tuberosum subsp. andigenum
473276 36.8 OKA 5486 Solanum tuberosum subsp. andigenum
587073 36.6 GABRIELA Solanum tuberosum
595415 36.6 CHASKA Solanum tuberosum
587068 36.5 MARIA Solanum tuberosum
281080 36.5 WAC 258 Solanum tuberosum subsp. andigenum
611078 36.3 PAPA CACHO Solanum tuberosum subsp. tuberosum
587067 36.1 TOLLOCAN Solanum tuberosum
280921 36.1 WAC 1291 Solanum tuberosum subsp. andigenum
319198 36 MIRKA Solanum tuberosum
225710 35.9 CCC 278 Solanum tuberosum subsp. andigenum
280871 35.9 WAC 70 Solanum tuberosum subsp. andigenum
310493 35.9 CCC 1395 Solanum tuberosum subsp. andigenum
642430 35.9 GUI VALLEY Solanum tuberosum
310467 35.8 DESIREE Solanum tuberosum
319426 35.8 BERTITA Solanum tuberosum
639205 35.8 BERNADETTE Solanum tuberosum
462333 35.6 VITA Solanum tuberosum
225686 35.5 CCC 261 Solanum tuberosum subsp. andigenum
320391 35.5 CCC 1410 Solanum tuberosum subsp. andigenum
321622 35.5 FINA Solanum tuberosum
225694 35.4 CCC 10 Solanum tuberosum subsp. andigenum
511845 35.4 SERRANA INTA Solanum tuberosum
26 35.3 OZETTE Solanum tuberosum
587050 35.3 URAN Solanum tuberosum
634779 35.3 JUICE VALLEY Solanum tuberosum
234015 35.2 GND 63 Solanum tuberosum subsp. andigenum
407410 35.2 MULTA Solanum tuberosum
238084 35.1 FORTUNA Solanum tuberosum
351052 35.1 JAAKKO Solanum tuberosum
281034 35 WAC 911 Solanum tuberosum subsp. andigenum
527879 35 FELTWELL Solanum tuberosum
225689 34.9 CCC 256 Solanum tuberosum subsp. andigenum
642429 34.9 UNICA Solanum tuberosum
362729 34.8 KANDIDAT Solanum tuberosum
527881 34.8 RODBROKIG SVENSK Solanum tuberosum
597779 34.7 ANCILLA Solanum tuberosum
217560 34.7 URGENTA Solanum tuberosum
546023 34.7 HOHL 253 Solanum tuberosum subsp. andigenum
607886 34.5 SS 7223 Solanum tuberosum subsp. andigenum
234007 34.4 GND 29 Solanum tuberosum subsp. andigenum
498310 34.4 HHCH 4856 Solanum tuberosum subsp. andigenum
527976 34.4 CLAVELA Solanum tuberosum
379596 34.3 CARIVNICA Solanum tuberosum
407420 34.3 KING EDWARD Solanum tuberosum
587048 34.2 ARMA Solanum tuberosum
383475 34.2 INDIA CLONE 1041 Solanum tuberosum
634778 34.2 GOGU VALLEY Solanum tuberosum
131750 34.1 OSTBOTE Solanum tuberosum
182477 34.1 GLADSTONE Solanum tuberosum
256977 34.1 ELENITA Solanum tuberosum
607502 34.1 TACNA Solanum tuberosum
515921 34 GRANOLA Solanum tuberosum
537045 34 PENTLAND MARBLE Solanum tuberosum
634531 34 COSTANERA Solanum tuberosum
595406 33.9 SYR-9 Solanum tuberosum
199102 33.9 VICTOR Solanum tuberosum
407425 33.9 UP TO DATE Solanum tuberosum
491542 33.9 Monserrate Solanum tuberosum
527927 33.9 RUTT Solanum tuberosum
657134 33.9 KINIGI Solanum tuberosum
451708 33.8 PENTLAND JAVELIN Solanum tuberosum
326021 33.7 JUANITA Solanum tuberosum
423632 33.7 KAMERAZ Solanum tuberosum
634777 33.7 EARLY VALLEY Solanum tuberosum
270542 33.6 SUSANNA Solanum tuberosum
320373 33.6 CCC 1364 Solanum tuberosum subsp. andigenum
320377 33.6 CCC 1374 Solanum tuberosum subsp. andigenum
634534 33.6 YUNGAY Solanum tuberosum
217448 33.5 SLU s.n. Solanum tuberosum subsp. andigenum
237739 33.5 DORE Solanum tuberosum
537035 33.5 STOBRAWA Solanum tuberosum
54 33.5 CALWHITE Solanum tuberosum
633606 33.5 CHARLOTTE Solanum tuberosum
320379 33.4 CCC 1378 Solanum tuberosum subsp. andigenum
537040 33.4 KINGSTON Solanum tuberosum
383471 33.4 INDIA CLONE 1035 Solanum tuberosum
15 33.3 GARNET CHILI Solanum tuberosum
587064 33.3 NEVSKII Solanum tuberosum
225667 33.3 CCC 147 Solanum tuberosum subsp. andigenum
12 33.2 EARLY ROSE Solanum tuberosum
587052 33.2 OMEGA Solanum tuberosum
451706 33.2 CROFT Solanum tuberosum
657135 33.2 MUZIRANZARA Solanum tuberosum
225688 33.1 CCC 234 Solanum tuberosum subsp. andigenum

nathanp

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Re: TPS 2020
« Reply #7 on: 2020-04-12, 06:16:58 PM »
Just another update and the link to the entire list  https://npgsweb.ars-grin.gov/gringlobal/descriptordetail.aspx?id=73178&fbclid=IwAR2JBrI26mVcC_p3UnZaBo8uvaDiq3ldGWw_kKqzfbjAfwgWKcwVOt8Suqg

These are some of those at the lower end of the list.  It appears the median amount is about 30.

AV 24    NORLAND   Solanum tuberosum   25.6
AV 56    CHIPETA   Solanum tuberosum   25.8
AV 55    CENTURY RUSSET   Solanum tuberosum   27.1
AV 11    EARLY OHIO   Solanum tuberosum   27.6
PI 344117    KENYA AKIBA   Solanum tuberosum   27.6
PI 657143    BASADRE   Solanum tuberosum   27.8
AV 40    BURBANK   Solanum tuberosum   28.0
AV 42    EARLY BLUE   Solanum tuberosum   28.0
AV 37    TRIUMPH   Solanum tuberosum   28.1
PI 587084    NEVSKY-3RD   Solanum tuberosum   28.1
PI 451705    MARIS BARD   Solanum tuberosum   28.1
PI 657148    CHAPOSA   Solanum tuberosum   28.1
PI 237741    ELLA   Solanum tuberosum   28.2
AV 13    ERIK   Solanum tuberosum   28.2
PI 633603    PITO   Solanum tuberosum   28.3
PI 657138    MURUTA   Solanum tuberosum   28.4
PI 633605    TORRIDON   Solanum tuberosum   28.4
PI 407409    MENTOR   Solanum tuberosum   28.4
PI 407416    ARRAN PILOT   Solanum tuberosum   28.6
PI 341778    ALPHA   Solanum tuberosum   28.6
AV 18    KATAHDIN   Solanum tuberosum   28.6
PI 161173    COR 14252   Solanum verrucosum   28.7
PI 199285    FRUHPERLE   Solanum tuberosum   28.7
PI 527977    LOW BAY   Solanum tuberosum subsp. tuberosum   28.8
PI 527978    LOMAN   Solanum tuberosum   28.8
PI 634776    BORA VALLEY   Solanum tuberosum   28.8
AV 19    KENNEBEC   Solanum tuberosum   31.3
AV 20    LEMHI RUSSET   Solanum tuberosum   31.2
AV 57    FRONTIER RUSSET   Solanum tuberosum   31.2

Ferdzy

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Re: TPS 2020
« Reply #8 on: 2020-04-12, 06:21:54 PM »
Holy Crow! I hope that was a copy-paste job and you didn't have to type it out!  :o

I'm in Canada, so neither the US nor the EU. A quick look at the Canadian Seed Catalogue Index of Seeds of Diversity suggests that Desiree is the only potato on the list currently available for sale in Canada. Canada does have a genebank, but I doubt I would qualify to get anything from it.

Edit: that was the first list; the second looks like it has some more familiar names on it. Thanks for the link; I will do some reading.
« Last Edit: 2020-04-12, 06:25:04 PM by Ferdzy »

nathanp

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Re: TPS 2020
« Reply #9 on: 2020-04-12, 08:20:34 PM »
The 2nd list are the ones you should avoid.  Stick to the ones that are the Amylose content 33 or higher.  The higher the better.  Remember that about 30-31 is the median for potatoes, so the lower the number the worse the glycemic index will be. 

I believe you can order from Agri-Canada, but it will probably cost a good amount in shipping. I heard an estimate of 60 CDN dollars recently.

whwoz

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Re: TPS 2020
« Reply #10 on: 2020-04-13, 03:26:21 AM »
ferry, have a look for Nicola potatoes. If you can find them they have a GI rating of 55 to 58.  We have a couple of others lower here in Oz,  but they would not be widely available. Don't know if they will form berries or not.  Desiree GI is 101

Ferdzy

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Re: TPS 2020
« Reply #11 on: 2020-04-13, 06:31:02 AM »
Yeah, thanks Whoz. Nicola is out there.

nathanp

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Re: TPS 2020
« Reply #12 on: 2020-04-13, 07:27:14 AM »
Can someone split this topic out of the original post?  This probably deserves to be it's own topic.

So regarding GI, there are multiple factors involved with resistant starch and types of sugar, so there are multiple factors involved in breeding potatoes for this purpose.

Here's an article that lists some specific potato varieties and GI ratings.

https://www.smh.com.au/lifestyle/health-and-wellness/in-defence-of-potatoes-20110808-1iirt.html

Richard Watson

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Re: TPS 2020
« Reply #13 on: 2020-04-18, 11:12:20 PM »
This volunteer TPS had been growing next to a pathway for quite a few years, hadn't bothered to dig it up till today, pleased I did, really taken with the pattern

Changeable year round climate, less so summertime, warming winters - just under 500mm average yearly rainfall. 20 years of soil improvements plus sub soil top soil reversal means my garden beds are about half metre deep. Below that is 100's of metres of alluvial out wash from the Southern
alps.

Ellendra

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Re: TPS 2020
« Reply #14 on: 2020-04-26, 10:34:24 AM »
Richard, I vote to name that variety "Purple Snowflake" or something similar. Those are pretty!
Harsh winters, high winds. Temps on the edge between zones 4 and 5. Steep, north-facing slope. Soil is high in clay and rocks. Fast draining, which is a surprise for clay soil. Indicates a sandy/gravelly layer underneath.