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Potatoes / Re: Potato Tomato Hybrid
« Last post by William S. on Today at 08:24:17 PM »
I kind of remember us talking about this possibility some time ago. I think there are one or two of the fourteen or so species tomatoes that have with difficulty gone both ways towards either tomatoes or potatoes. Though the dream of making a genetic tomato potato has never been realized by mainstream plant breeders. Sometimes it is the case that amateurs who arent dependant on funding or answerable to a university or corporation may have potential to succeed where professionals just can't because of all the pressures including the need to keep endless records and write endless reports. Definitely would need to get good at plant tissue culture and embryo rescue of immature fruits.

I believe the cell fusion approach Andrew mentions is one the plants from test rubes book mentions has been abandoned by the mainstream and is therefore an opportunity for amateurs as it was perhaps never fully explored and may have unrealized potential. Particularly for plants. Another reason to get really good at plant tissue culture.

Another thought on this. I think Tim Peters tried to make a perennial tomato from some rhizomatous habrochaites lines. Likewise, if just very moderately successful a potato is a organ that increases the perennial nature of a plant. So you could realize Tim's vision of a perennial tomato.

I would collect lots of species tomatoes and species potatoes and work on my plant tissue culture skills if I was gearing up to attempt such a thing by either plausible route.

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So, could hydroponically grown slips be a viable alternative to bulking up seed?
It's easy to make slips from any growing vine. It could be in an actual hydroponic system or just a glass of water on a windowsill or growing in the ground or pot in a greenhouse. Any section of vine at least a couple inches long with a leaf joint will root and in a little wile be big enough to make still more slips from it. And by then you can get more from the older one.  It isn't a substitute for seeds though cause it still requires keeping either a plant or roots alive during the off season. 

If that's the case, maybe I could get some slips from you guys who have reliable seed setting varieties,  but not enough seed to share. Or I could attempt it on my own. Are the ornamental varieties better at seed set? Is there better seed set with different varieties vs selfed?
I don't really make the distinction between ornamental and culinary anymore. All it means is if they make useable sized storage roots or not and that I think is just another variable trait in the species. I do think my initial luck in the project was because of the chance discovery of a self fertile "ornamental" and that trait got passed into my overall grex but most existing varieties are not self fertile. I don't really know the percentage of mine that are because I grow them all in a polyculture.

I only check this thread occasionally,  so I'm not sure what the state of this project is at this point in time. How are you all getting along with it?
Currently the "turning sweet potatoes into a seed grown annual" project is largely complete. This year I planted seeds directly in the ground and had about 30% germination within a couple of weeks. That was enough and fast enough to more than fill my planting area. Many that didn't come up fast enough were just left crowded in the planting bed, some ended up blooming but most came up too late to make much roots. A smaller number planted at the same time in a cold frame had about 70% germination in time to plant out but I didn't have enough space and favored the direct planted ones.

There are still lots of questions I'd like to answer but not likely to be able to, especially concerning compatibility. Who is self fertile and why? Who is compatible with one or more particular other and not another and why? Who is compatible with one or more other but only in one direction?  Are there any that are compatible with most or all others? Are self fertile ones compatible with others as a rule or are most of their seeds selfed? And lots of others like how are traits passed on?

I doubt I will ever know those answers cause it is just way more than I could do to answer them and the university scientists don't seem to care or if they do they don't seem to write about it. They just do large scale polycross looking for the next one to patent as a clone. They don't care about garden scale growing from seed. 

From what I read pretty much all traits are quantitive so I have just been applying what I call genetic distillation, trying to  cull out those that don't make nice roots, that have giant vines, don't bloom well or don't taste good. Stuff I can do just by looking and tasting, no need for microscopes, DNA tests and mountains of records.

This year I ended up with about 20 that meet most or all of my favored criteria. I archived most of my seeds in sealed test tubes, inside stainless steel canisters buried in the ground. Next year I'm planning on growing mostly just clones of those 20 with hope to make a new elite line of seeds.

State of the seeds right now is roughly. A single seed has about a 30% chance of sprouting within two weeks planted directly in the ground. That plant has probably a 95% chance that it will bloom and set seed, assuming it has an appropriate partner or is self fruitful. It has about a 70% chance that it will make nice roots and seeds within 100 days of sprouting. Probably 70% chance it will have bushy rather than large vine growth habit. I won't venture a guess on lots of other things like color, flavor and so on.

I am hopeful that the seeds produced next year will reveal all kinds of wonder things in 2022. Also I'm making more effort next year to give them better soil and take better care of them so as to learn their real potential as far as yield. If any of of those 20 show superior there I might also clone them again in 2022.

"What a long strange trip it's been"
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Cucurbits / Re: Luffa/loofah
« Last post by Mike Crane on Yesterday at 07:26:36 PM »
Thank you, just connected with that thread.
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Plant Breeding / Re: Breeding short season cold climate luffa
« Last post by Mike Crane on Yesterday at 07:25:11 PM »
Am new to both this site and growing luffa. I grew first luffa this year. As pilot pilot wound up planting late but id pick 1 mature and 50 almost mature luffs. Am not 100% sure which variety I grew but rareseeds.com says it is Luffa aegyptiaca. Two aspects want to improve are size of sponges and length to maturity. I am in zone 7a
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Sweet Potatoes / Re: Common flowering cultivars
« Last post by Andrew Barney on Yesterday at 04:56:18 AM »
I'm gonna try the grafting thing again as soon as my batata slips get going.

Is the grafting meant to be in michurin style? If so, that could be a nifty way to increase seed set. Graft variety 1 on variety 2 and also vice versa and then maybe they will accept the pollen more easily between varieties.
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From what I've seen if you grow sweet potatoes in water they don't make any storage roots at all, even if it's one that does make roots when grown in soil. They do bloom and make seeds though. I don't know if this might be a way to induce blooming or not but if you like the greens it is definitely a way to produce them in abundance and the fish in a small artificial pond really enjoy it too. Some kind of bugs hide, or may just tasty algae grows in those root mats and the little bluegills are always looking around in them. Or maybe they just like hiding in them too.

So, could hydroponically grown slips be a viable alternative to bulking up seed?

If that's the case, maybe I could get some slips from you guys who have reliable seed setting varieties,  but not enough seed to share. Or I could attempt it on my own. Are the ornamental varieties better at seed set? Is there better seed set with different varieties vs selfed?

I only check this thread occasionally,  so I'm not sure what the state of this project is at this point in time. How are you all getting along with it?
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Cucurbits / Re: Luffa/loofah
« Last post by Andrew Barney on 2020-11-25, 11:15:05 AM »
Does anyone have a good source on information on luffa. I grew them for the first time this year and thought a project on improved sponges might be productive and useful.

I haven't ever grown them, so i know nothing. But here is another thread that was started recently last year i think.

http://opensourceplantbreeding.org/forum/index.php?topic=122.0
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Richard was talking over on the NZ thread about seeds sprouting and think they were weeds because the came up under another already established one. I think that might be what happened with the ones in this picture. I was cleaning up where I had dumped my pots yesterday and found them buried. I don't recall seeing them during harvest and they are small plus the whole plant is intact. I expect their seeds had hitchhiked when I transplanted others, came up later and I didn't even notice they were there, they just got covered up when I harvested the others.

If you look at the one on the left the storage roots are all connected in a string, I call that crater root because if grown in the ground you have to dig a cater to find them.  The one on the right is a beautiful example of clump root, a bunch of nice ones all together right under the main stem. Even if I had noticed it before I would have discarded the one on the left. I think I'll keep the other one though especially since it tastes great.
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Plant Breeding / Re: Walnut species hybridization project
« Last post by Richard Watson on 2020-11-24, 12:42:24 PM »
The juglans regia walnuts need moisture and germinate even if the temperatures aren't too high.  I harvested mine about six weeks ago, placed them in tubs, outside, in the back of the garden, to avoid a rat infestation, and they started to germinate now  in these tubs, after these six weeks or so.  We had some colder nights (maybe 4 or 5), but day temperatures were also unseasonally high. So I suspect they don't need stratification.  The ones here are very hard, but clearly j. regia.  I use a bench screw to crack them, a hammer works as well but the result can be quite a mess because they do need a hard blow...I could send you some , Richard, but there could be import restictions for these, and secondly, they're no fun to crack (but very tasty!),
Frank
Thanks for the offer Frank but they are a restricted variety here. Besides walnuts are so common meaning there lots to select seed from. I'm keen to get some of these easy opening nuts to grow
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Plant Breeding / Re: Walnut species hybridization project
« Last post by galina on 2020-11-24, 02:15:40 AM »
I would buy grafts from somewhere. Walnuts usually don't produce nuts until they are around 10 13 years old from seed.

I know absolutely nothing about walnuts, but I watched a chance seedling at a neighbour's garden produce nuts 5 years later.  Was that a fluke?  Definitely not a grafted walnut.  Good luck with the project.
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